Hi @emre
I know you have done some work in this area after my initial conversations. Currently testing under V5.1.56 and found a few anomalies:
Balance Button does not work with Multiple Entities
I have tried to move Entity:Customer from Top Line but attaching Entity:Bar Wallet 1st manually but this cannot use Balance Button to pay Ticket + Account?
Use Balance Button then Display Ticket 1st Load (From Ticket Menu)
You can see it displays negatives which can then be assigned by Balance Button? Note: I have specifically used an Entity:Customer with no other Entities.
The idea with balance button is… processing ticket first and use remaining amount (change amount) to decrease from customer account. As we don’t have multiple account feature I assumed there is a single customer account with a positive balance. For payments through account you should click related payment type button. I can’t tell what it really does when you have multiple ones. Maybe I should just disable it for now when we have multiple entities that have balances.
Regarding payment processor what it does is not correct. It should only round ticket amount not the whole balance. imho rounding customer’s account balance is something it should not do.
OK. I thought you somethow enabled balance mode while there are multiple entities but realized later it was something else. So I’ve corrected negative button issue.
Regarding rounding this is a hard issue to solve. We need processing as @QMcKay using it for processing account payments. Rounding adds to ticket as a ticket calculation. However processor makes calculation from balance. As ticket balance is different than processor uses to calculate rounding, round calculation recalculates a different value. This is tough as we can’t just limit processors to use ticket balance. I’ll try to find a solution.
Well, I don’t need to use the Payment Screen for processing Account Payments… I just thought it might be a “quick way” to do so if it were possible.
At first, I had no idea what the Balance button was for, until @Jesse pointed out its purpose. And so I thought “voila” - we have a method to use the Payment Screen for making Account Payments.
But honestly, in the end, it is a bit of a kludge in that - as you mention - the Calculation selectors are Ticket-based. So we cannot use them natively to apply, for example, a 10% Tip.
Also, as I mentioned in the other thread, we don’t have access to define the Tx Doc or Tx Type descriptions that are used to pay a Ticket, which is what you say the Payment Screen “really needs” to operate.
At this point, it still isn’t really working the way I want it to. So I have since built out automation to make Account Payments, which I was required to do anyway in order to make Credit payments for accounts with zero balance… the Payment Screen will not allow Account Payment unless the account is in arrears.
Now that I built the Automation for applying Credit, I don’t really need the Payment Screen any longer, so why bother with it at all? The “quick way” has become moot.
Oh I thought you are using it. I don’t know why I’ve said payment screen really needs that descriptions. Maybe I didn’t understand it or used wrong words to explain that but I’ve added description templates for transactions request to my list. %Tip calculation is ticket based as all calculations are ticket based by default. Using a fixed amount tip calculation instead could be a solution maybe? We can use scripts to calculate tip amount…
To be able to give a good answers for setups I’m not familiar with I need to setup the case on my side and study it until I get the idea. However sometimes while coding something I can’t break it and do something else, so my answers may not be good enough. Maybe I need another laptop to use when I can’t use dev machine for something else. So seems like I couldn’t supported that case fine. I’m sorry for that.
No worries at all @emre. I just wanted to let you know that I have not implemented this into production yet, and when I do, I will probably eliminate using Payment Screen for Account Payment, for the different reasons cited.
Happy New Year to you too! (about 11.5 hours away yet for me)
Hey Sorry I missed the ongoing discussion guys but yes given that I was (still am) 7+hours ahead of you Emre - the party had definitely started! But now, that party has ended here, and time to address your points above
Ok @emre - from my example above I selected another Entity Type first (“Bar Wallet”) and then tried to use the Balance button but this failed. The point was I think you have hard coded it to look for a “Customer” Entity Name Balance the same way you have done “Credit Limit”? Credit limit seem to be a “hidden feature” if you create a custom field on a Entity Type.
Please No@emre, as you have said before it is a feature! - “Top Ups” or Access to Pay out Customer Account Balances here is a good thing.
The way in my opinion it should work:
First Press of Balance Button → Offer to Pay Ticket + 1st Entity Listed Balance
Second Press of Balance Button → Offer to Pay Ticket + 2nd Entity Listed Balance
Third Press of Balance Button → Offer to Pay Ticket + 3rd Entity Listed Balance
Fourth Press…[cycle here through entities]
Last Press Balance Button → Offer to Pay Ticket + ALLEntities Listed Balance
Next Balance Button → Offer to Pay Ticket Balance Only
Notes:
I understand this is a unique characteristic (Multiple Entities) used here but it is still within a normal boundaries of SambaPOS as you can have Multiple Entities and every entity can have Accounts.
It would be great to have control over the Templates Captions for Balance, Payment Types etc. At least it would be great to maybe show Balance Amount in Caption Button BEFORE you click as this gives an indication of which Entity and/or Ticket Balance you are selecting.
Hope this makes sense?
Ticket Tracking
The other issue which may come to light is show below:
It would be great to actually show the Ticket No? Actually clicking on Find Ticket works but as you may have fixed in V5.1.57 it shown no evidence of a Balance of Account Payment? This is by design and not sure how you can do this… especially with multiple Entity Account Payments. Emre only you can dig around this one…
I mentioned the same thing. More to the point, I requested control over the Transaction Description since it appears to be hard-coded for Ticket Payments. Emre might have fixed this, and even added the feature… I will take a look.
Yea, not sure if it hit & miss as I have only seen ticket No. saved once? The version I am using is the final 5.1.56 and know there has been a few beta’s released after that. Just about to down 5.1.57 and retest…
Beat me to it! If display the Ticket Settlement (Payment) Screen you will also find no evidence of Customer Balance Payment - only monies assigned to ticket. I think this has always been the case…
I have done some testing on the latest refresh V5.1.57 (2nd I think) and here is what I have found:
Multiple Entities
The Balance button does nothing. This has been disabled ONLY if another Entity is found with an Account. @emre - I really hope you can check my post above and in particular my suggestion on subsequent pushes of the Balance Button with Multipple Entity Accounts
Single Entity - Payment Processor
This now functions ok, except the CASH button just shows the incorrect amount as shown below. If CASH Button is used the Full Balance is paid and the correct journals are created for Ticket.
Journals
Again if a Total Payment for all Entities was implemented then the only requirement would be to list these in the Journal below as show by 01555-Simon Wallace. For Example:
01555-Simon Wallance
02000B-Simon Wallance (Wallet 2)
[EDIT] FINAL COMMENT:
I think there is a need for the Balance to work as I have outlines. Why? Well I will implement Family Accounts such as Husband, Wife, Son etc. I can see the Father coming in to the Venue and making 1 payment to pay all Accounts shown. I think a Family Account Option is very desired and beneficial. To implement Family Accounts in Samba is as easy and that why I getting more and more hooked on Samba!
Nothing stressed me more than payment processors + balance mode in entire SambaPOS history. I’m working for hours trying to figure out just updating button captions correctly but there are infinite number of different cases here. Seems like a full rewrite is needed for payment system for a complete solution and we should detach payments & calculations from tickets to be able to handle all of these correctly. I never planned that screen will be used for such uses. QMcKay & pauln sorry for that… That’s all we’ll be able to do for V5’s Payment Screen. Let me know issues regarding existing features but I won’t add more functionality other than ticket payments on this screen.
Ok then @emre - the way it works now is ok with this refresh (V5.1.57 2/1/16 10.59am) except you just need to show the correct Caption on “CASH” button as show above. Is that possible?
See above $12.98 “Total” but $7.00 “Cash” - should be $12.98 Cash rounded out.
[EDIT]
The trick is where does Round Value go. Against Ticket, so Ticket is $1.99 but Balance is $1.99 + $3.99 = $5.98 the round value is 2 cents. I guess you just always Round Ticket Value and save that portion to Ticket and any Balance Round to Account - in this case 1 cent. Ummm, either way this must been a problem even with 1 Entity assigned from previous versions?
especially with multiple Entity Account Payments. Emre only you can dig around this one…
